POPE SANDOR i want to see that non-essay
pope sandor had me dangerously close to swallowing my hard candy whole
I have a photoshop file named “Sandor Clegane Warrior Pope” filled with doodled drawings of his possible adventures as High Septon
just imagine him wearing the Seven-Pointed Crystal Rainbow Crown
I was walking home today and thinking about the list of Sandor essays I still need to write in order to feel complete as a human being, and for Sandor Studies 101 to be done. (Imagine that for each subject, I feel like I have something to add that hasn’t been talked about before. Some of them are really short, others long.)
Here are the titles:
hmmm I need to make a master post or something for this class
Sandor Clegane’s story is one about an idealistic little boy who was severely abused, his reaction to that abuse, and how the nihilistic life philosophy that came from that abuse only resulted in more abuse. His story is a sea of abuse, he drowned in violence. He was so broken by living of a life of violence, that he DEMONSTRABLY did not know how to behave like a normal adult man or at all how to relate to other people.
GRRM felt so much sympathy for this character that he (this author with the reputation for being heartless toward his characters) waved his hand and invented (in the very middle of a war-torn country) an entire beautiful little island full of monks and medieval therapy and solidarity and peace. Only for the sake of this one character.
Maybe so he could show the hope that, for anyone given that shitty of a life’s beginning, to anyone that demoralized or idealistically broken, to anyone that has been abused, there can be a place of recovery. That no matter what life deals you, or however long you spend living like a beast or being treated as a sub-human, you can turn around and learn to be a human.
It breaks my heart that the people making the show took this character, who is at the very beating heart of GRRM’s anti-violence, anti-war message, and transformed him into a
straight-up badass who makes violence seem great.
They took a living example of what the horrors of violence can do to people and
made it seem cool, made it seem okay.
I am interested to the point of fixation on characters that are used explore gender roles and social identity and abuse recovery.
When a grown-ass man who is a self-aggrandized heartless killing machine breaks down and sobs “like a little baby” after re-living the worst traumatic experience of his childhood, it makes you, as a consumer of media:
I am not interested in stories where people get in fights and then win fights that they get into. Which is all you can say about the scene after watching it: “A guy got into a fight with another guy and won.” You can say absolutely nothing more about either character than you knew at the beginning of the scene. The scene in the show was about as character-revealing and thought-provoking as dirt.
Give me character development or give me death. Don’t strip the character moments out of scenes and then make me sit through them, I would rather punch myself in the face.
So in the books, it’s stated that Myrcella didn’t cry when she left, she was very composed and tried to cheer up Tommen. On the show, she was shown openly crying.
In the books, it’s stated that Sandor was crying and pleading when he was burnt - he was sobbing, begging for help, etc. On the show, he does not cry and apparently makes some cruel remark about Mycah?
That makes sense. Yeah. Okay. I see what you’re doing here, Dick and Douche.
THE BOOK SPECIFICALLY SAYS HE CRIES LIKE A LITTLE BABY
“Please,” Sandor Clegane rasped, cradling his arm. “I’m burned. Help me. Someone. Help me.” He was crying. “Please.”
Arya looked at him in astonishment. He’s crying like a little baby, she thought.
This is what doesn’t make any sense to me. From Blackwater on, the show has made a point of reminding us how wigged out Sandor is by fire - and rightly so. Yet in the one scene from the book where his fear and his trauma and the very core of his fucked-upedness comes to a head and he reverts to a wounded, frightened little boy, they give us a laughing, joking Sandor instead.
It’s like they had all this build-up to this one moment and then said, “Ha, fooled you! He’s not really afraid of fire. He’s way too much of a bad-ass to cry like a little girl.What the fuck do you think we’re adapting here? George R.R. Martin or something?”
At which point amplifyme raises her hand and says, “Um, wait. What?”
I’m calling it right now. If they run rough-shod over the road trip to come, I’m bailing on the show. I can use the $17 a month I spend on HBO for new copies of ASOIAF and spend the extra 10 hours reading the story as it was meant to be told.
Fuck you, B&W. Just fuck you.
got night today
if sandor clegane cries…
it was a pleasure to meet you all.
i’ll die if it happens but also i will die if it doesn’t happen
so bye guys have fun planning my funeral
if we get manly sobbing i’ll die but if we don’t someone else will die because i’ll stab them in the eye with a rusty spork
if it doesn’t happen I’ll carve someone’s heart out with a spoon
Sansa knew most of the hymns, and followed along on those she did not know as best she could. She sang along with grizzled old serving men and anxious young wives, with serving girls and soldiers, cooks and falconers, knights and knaves, squires and spit boys and nursing mothers. She sang with those inside the castle walls and those without, sang with all the city. She sang for mercy, for the living and the dead alike, for Bran and Rickon and Robb, for her sister Arya and her bastard brother Jon Snow, away off on the Wall. She sang for her mother and her father, for her grandfather Lord Hoster and her uncle Edmure Tully, for her friend Jeyne Poole, for old drunken King Robert, for Septa Mordane and Ser Dontos and Jory Cassel and Maester Luwin, for all the brave knights and soldiers who would die today, and for the children and the wives who would mourn them, and finally, toward the end, she even sang for Tyrion the Imp and for the Hound. He is no true knight but he saved me all the same, she told the Mother. Save him if you can, and gentle the rage inside him.
basically what convinced me that sandor is the gravedigger on the quiet isle is the fact that when brienne describes sansa (and let’s be honest it’s a super general description) the elder brother instantly knew who she was talking about and he even says her name real quiet and surprised
like how else would he have known sansa stark from that bare bones description if he hadn’t been talking to sandor clegane, the guy who mentions her every five fucking minutes
The other thing that cinched the deal for me was EB mentioning in his soliloquy about Sandor that even his driving force (vengence against his brother) was taken away from him in the end. It doesn’t fit the timeline at all. When Sandor & Arya meet up with Polliver and the Tickler at the inn, one of the men mentions that Gregor is on his way to KL (for the fight with Oberyn). But Arya leaves Sandor on the banks of the Trident the very next day and the EB finds him shortly after. How could Sandor have died and been buried there within a day or two of being injured and still know about Gregor’s death? It would’ve taken Gregor time to travel from the riverlands to KL and then a few weeks more to die from the poison on Oberyn’s spear and then even more time for word to reach the Quiet Isle. Sandor Clegane is alive and well.
Mmm. The global timeline someone did on Westeros.org says Oberyn & Gregor’s duel was several weeks before Arya and Sandor met Gregor’s men at the Inn, but that has always made little to no sense to me and I figure he did his math wrong somewhere. Especially if you consider that Gregor’s men at Harrenhal should have been informed of his fate in the trial much earlier than a small island refuge for penitents.
Though, actually I should compare AFFC Cersei IV (where she tells the Small Council Gregor is dead). Hmm, that timeline has it at 3/8/300… and Sandor dying is at 2/9/300… so that settles that, then. There’s no way the Elder Brother finding a dying Sandor could have told him that Gregor was dead. Poisoned, perhaps, and dying, but not dead. (Note per that timeline Brienne arrives at the QI a month after Cersei makes her announcement, so that at least makes sense.)
But yes, the EB recognizing Sansa immediately from a very brief description is the biggest giveaway, really.
All of the things in the chapter where Brienne goes to the Quiet Isle, from the description of how to cross the water to the island to every single thing Septon Meribald’s dog does since the dog is introduced (I promise that dog has very little purpose in this story except to be a call back to Sandor) to Stranger to the Elder Brother’s back story to the Elder Brother in general to actually showing a big huge limping guy with his face suspiciously covered, are like white-hot exclamation marks that he’s still alive.
headtripxhoney replied to your post: whenever i see someone refer to sandor clegane as…
i just mentally hear chelsea crying sandooooor in her ASOIAF accent challenge
i think chelsea and i have had this discussion, lol
whenever i see someone refer to sandor clegane as the hound i literally have this visceral reaction that generally involves me growling at the computer screen and internally screaming THE HOUND IS DEAD
i just cringe at the idea of referring to him as the hound since it is really a dehumanizing name and yeah c’mon the hound is dead refer to him by his real name sandor clegane!
and if you take the hound = a deconstruction of the beast trope (which i think is a good argument to be made, and has been made by much smarter people than me) then referring to him as the hound and glorifying it is kind of just really missing the point of his character and his characterization? and his place in westerosi society and the role in general of men like sandor in westerosi society and how it contributes to the hypocrisy of chivalry and knighthood
badass warrior of course
tbh i eagerly await/hope that we’ll see him post-qi and he’ll be gentler and healthier and all the fanboys will be sad and outraged
It’s the equivalent of unironically calling Arya a “little badass assassin”